New Church 32nd & Clinton

[Vic0218]

The whole idea here is that folks are aware of what's happening in the 'hood.

Hopefully things can be sorted out.

Hopefully. 

Beans...to an outsider it appears your (and Vic's) complaints always fell on deaf ears down there.

Vic talking about your neighbors holding your block hostage.  The punks who tried to burn your house down.

You were left shrugging your shoulders.

Maybe now that others' Utopian lots are being disrupted they'll pay attention to you.

I don't think there's a solution to the problem of undesirables in a neighborhood.  And the police are not there to prevent situations, just respond to them. That's in no way a diss on the ones who protect us, just a statement of fact. They can't determining who can move in or live in a neighborhood. I imagine they must get tired of responding to the same calls in our neighborhood all the time. I have nothing but respect for the efforts they make.

I give up. I am fully surrounded - sex offender on the south, problem teens on the west, seriel thief on the east, and now the new questionable non-residents to the north. And there is absolutely nothing to do about it except shut the windows and stay inside.

Not my idea of a good environment for the kiddies and it actually is pretty stressful, so plan B is looking more attractive each passing day.

Beans - we've talked about this - but I really don't think much of anything (good) is going to come of this. I would love to be pleasantly surprised.

[Beans]

The whole idea here is that folks are aware of what's happening in the 'hood.

Hopefully things can be sorted out.

Hopefully. 

Beans...to an outsider it appears your (and Vic's) complaints always fell on deaf ears down there.

Vic talking about your neighbors holding your block hostage.  The punks who tried to burn your house down.

You were left shrugging your shoulders.

Maybe now that others' Utopian lots are being disrupted they'll pay attention to you.

I don't think there's a solution to the problem of undesirables in a neighborhood.  And the police are not there to prevent situations, just respond to them. That's in no way a diss on the ones who protect us, just a statement of fact. They can't determining who can move in or live in a neighborhood. I imagine they must get tired of responding to the same calls in our neighborhood all the time. I have nothing but respect for the efforts they make.

I give up. I am fully surrounded - sex offender on the south, problem teens on the west, seriel thief on the east, and now the new questionable non-residents to the north. And there is absolutely nothing to do about it except shut the windows and stay inside.

Not my idea of a good environment for the kiddies and it actually is pretty stressful, so plan B is looking more attractive each passing day.

Beans - we've talked about this - but I really don't think much of anything (good) is going to come of this. I would love to be pleasantly surprised.

Vic - ditto.

[MRS. NORTHSIDER]

After reading some material on the Victory Outreach group I don't think I'd be very happy having them as a neighbor either especially with the way they've been conducting themselves so far.  It's unfortunate that the Presbyterian Church was able to just sell to them without any input from the city.  With the information out there on the web about this group I especially find it reprehensible that the church leaders weren't more selective about the sale given the residential character of the neighborhood.

[Scouts Honor]

"With the information out there on the web about this group I especially find it reprehensible that the church leaders weren't more selective about the sale given the residential character of the neighborhood."

Quite frankly, I would initiate a class action suit and clean out their
Presbyterian arseholes for damages; quality of life, property value, new crime to the hood etc.

[Classof67]

I found this description of Victory Outreach on a site  that researches relgious cults, sects, new religious  movements, alternative religions, apologetics-, anticult-, and countercult organizations, doctrines, religious practices and world views. These resources reflect a variety of theological and/or sociological perspectives.

The website is www.apologeticsindex.org

Victory Outreach is described as:

"Victory Outreach Ministries
Founded in 1967 in Los Angeles, California, by Sonny Arguinzoni, an ordained Assemblies of God minister, Victory Outreach is a ministry that reaches out primarily to drug addicts, gang members, and ex-inmates."

[MRS. NORTHSIDER]

I found this description of Victory Outreach on a site  that researches relgious cults, sects, new religious  movements, alternative religions, apologetics-, anticult-, and countercult organizations, doctrines, religious practices and world views. These resources reflect a variety of theological and/or sociological perspectives.

The website is www.apologeticsindex.org

Victory Outreach is described as:

"Victory Outreach Ministries
Founded in 1967 in Los Angeles, California, by Sonny Arguinzoni, an ordained Assemblies of God minister, Victory Outreach is a ministry that reaches out primarily to drug addicts, gang members, and ex-inmates."

An ordained "Assemblies of God" minister - what religious demonination are they referring to and is it a recognized religion (meaning for right now tax exempt)?

[Classof67]

Mrs. N...

Assemblies of God is a old church that originated in the early 1900s and is
Evangelical.  Victory Outreach is Evangelical.

[MRS. NORTHSIDER]

Mrs. N...

Assemblies of God is a old church that originated in the early 1900s and is
Evangelical.  Victory Outreach is Evangelical.

So they're basically one and the same albeit with a new focus.

[Classof67]

Mrs. N...

Assemblies of God is a old church that originated in the early 1900s and is
Evangelical.  Victory Outreach is Evangelical.

So they're basically one and the same albeit with a new focus.

I understand Evangelical faith, but I don't know enough about Victory Outreach and their approach to say they are basically one and the same.  Hopefully, the Berwyn Victory Outreach will be successful to turning peoples' lives around while maintaining harmony with the few disgruntled neighbors.  Can I have an AMEN?

[OakParkSpartan]

"With the information out there on the web about this group I especially find it reprehensible that the church leaders weren't more selective about the sale given the residential character of the neighborhood."

Quite frankly, I would initiate a class action suit and clean out their
Presbyterian arseholes for damages; quality of life, property value, new crime to the hood etc.

Maybe Da Mayor can act as your attorney?

[buzz]

Bear, you have no standing in the court.
What happens when a church leaves town ?  Seriously.  Did the parishioners all go somewhere else ?  Do they open up shop in a new location ?  Who gets the $$$$ from the property sale ?

[Scouts Honor]

You go for "corporate" buzz, they are the ones who sold.

Here they are if any of you neighbors want to drop them an
e-mail and tell them how you feel about the sale.

http://www.pcanet.org/

[Classof67]

Bear, you have no standing in the court.
What happens when a church leaves town ?  Seriously.  Did the parishioners all go somewhere else ?  Do they open up shop in a new location ?  Who gets the $$$$ from the property sale ?

I don't think the parishioners, as a whole, are "neighbors".  This isn't an outreach for little old ladies with blue hair and the all American families.  Their outreach is for those that need a hand-up from drugs, crime,  prostitution, etc.  Seriously.  VO owns that church, so they win or lose. 

[Terri]

Bear, you have no standing in the court.
What happens when a church leaves town ?  Seriously.  Did the parishioners all go somewhere else ?  Do they open up shop in a new location ?  Who gets the $$$$ from the property sale ?

Buzz brought up good questions. Why did the Presbyterians leave Berwyn? Did they leave and sell the building due to financial difficulties or merge with another congregation?

What recourse does a community have when a "church" disrupts a neighborhood? Why Berwyn? 

[Classof67]

Why did the Presbyterians leave Berwyn? Did they leave and sell the building due to financial difficulties or merge with another congregation?

What recourse does a community have when a "church" disrupts a neighborhood? Why Berwyn? 

For the Presbyterians' last newsletter (attached below) published in January, 2009, it looks like they are sharing the church facilities with the First Lutheran Church at 31st & Euclid.  I would guess the Presbyterian congregation attending the church at 32nd & Clinton had dwindled and possibly it was no longer economically feasible to keep the building. 

Maybe Tony La could shed some light on who brokered the sale from the Presbyterians to Victory Outreach.
Perhaps that realtor found the buyer and everyone can thank them. 

[Scouts Honor]

"Perhaps that realtor found the buyer and everyone can thank them."

Class, your so thoughtful in your choice of words lol.

[Bonster]

"Hopefully, the Berwyn Victory Outreach will be successful to turning peoples' lives around while maintaining harmony with the few disgruntled neighbors. Can I have an AMEN?" - Classof97


But...is it just a few?

Do you really believe this is a noble cause?

[Classof67]

"Perhaps that realtor found the buyer and everyone can thank them."

Class, your so thoughtful in your choice of words lol.

Well, damnitalltohell...someone's responsible!   

[Peridot 16]

It seems that this group, Victory Outreach Church, swoops in on low income inner city areas. Honestly, I don't know how this group operates, but I am exteremly wary. Living in the area, I always thought of it as a working middle-class, decent family friendly neighborhood.  I do like living here, walking distance to the train, decent restaurants, Proksa park and my neighbors. But, all things change, and it is now time to move on and out.
Right or wrong, this group needs to be monitored. They have services on Sunday that end at 12:30, but the members hang around outside on the sidewalk til at least 2pm, Wednesday evening they start arriving at 5:30pm for 7pm -8:30pm services and don't leave the area til at least 9:30pm, congregating on the steps and sidewalk, actually yelling, whistling,kids screaming and running amok.  Friday, is a replay of Wednesday.  Tuesday and Thursday from 7pm-9pm a group, 20-30 people,  uses the building for music practice. They do have the front doors closed, but, they think they are rock stars and blast the music and it can be heard on the street. This "Christain" group shows no consideration for the area, any day they are here.
A few disgruntled neighbors, YES, but the rest are just waiting for an upturn in the economy, waiting to put there homes fo sale, and when this happens, this area will be the "new north Berwyn".

[Scouts Honor]

Show some backbone Peridot,
are you going to let friggin punks walk
all over you?

There are options. The police are your friends.