Dancing with the Stars - New Season

[billyjean]

Well, with this new season we seem to have some controversy.

BerwynPatsy ... buckle your seat belt.

First, we have Chaz Bono who now as a man will be dancing with a female partner.  Conservative groups are threatening to boycott.  Articles have been written and opinions given from doctors and conservatives on how this is not a healthy way to go for ABC and this very popular show.  You can only imagine what the articles go into so I won't bother to post any of that here.  The rebuttals, however, are all the same, and that is ... it's something that will help other ppl who have similar situation.  Brings them out of the closet so to speak and gives the big stamp of approval that says ... there's nothing wrong with you and you are just another human being.  Different from the masses, but still an individual that should be accepted in the world.

Second, we have Carson Kressley, who I happen to enjoy.  He makes me laugh and I'm sure will provide a wacky sense of humor to the program.

So here you have it.  Chaz and Carson.  The conservative groups feel ABC is pushing a gay/lesbian/agenda.  The retort back is that these are all ppl and have every right to appear on the show.  That Chaz born a woman, changed to a man should be able to dance his heart out.  That Carson, a gay man should be able to do same.  Two ppl who represent their respective groups are out there showing everyone ... see we are just like everyone else.  I get that.

Here's the only thing I see that is disingenuous:

Chaz dancing with a woman ... CORRECT, however,
Carson dancing with a woman ... INCORRECT.

He is gay.  And since dancing, especially on DWTS, which uses ballroom style dancing as the format of the show always involves a level of partners acting like they are romantic or are flirting, watching Carson dance with a woman is ridiculous.  Chaz with a female partner makes sense.  He is now a man, and basically changed so he could have MAN/WOMAN relationships.  Carson on the other hand is gay, and his acting flirty or romantic with a woman would be like watching a love scene today between an actress and Rock Hudson.    (btw, I put that out of my mind when I watch his old movies).

I'm very surprised that Carson, who is usually brutally candid, would go along with this farce.  He should have said to ABC, look..... I'm gay ... I want a male dance partner. 

I guess ABC is willing to get controversial, but not that controversial.  If the gay community isn't up in arms about this now, I guess it will start the minute Carson hits the floor.

Get the popcorn ready, Patsy.

[Ted]

So here you have it.  Chaz and Carson.  The conservative groups feel ABC is pushing a gay/lesbian/agenda.  The retort back is that these are all ppl and have every right to appear on the show.  That Chaz born a woman, changed to a man should be able to dance his heart out.  That Carson, a gay man should be able to do same.  Two ppl who represent their respective groups are out there showing everyone ... see we are just like everyone else.  I get that.

Here's the only thing I see that is disingenuous:

Chaz dancing with a woman ... CORRECT, however,
Carson dancing with a woman ... INCORRECT.

First off, DWTS has already had a gay contestant - Lance Bass.  Why weren't you complaining when Lance was on the show.

  Second, when Bristol Palin was on the show, does that mean DWTS was pushing a conservative agenda?

  Third, why can't a gay man dance with a woman? Why is that incorrect?  They're not having sex - they're just dancing, for gosh sakes.

[Bonster]

Chaz being on there seems like a publicity stunt.  There's lots of ppl like him/her.

Third, why can't a gay man dance with a woman?

It wouldn't surprise me if some of the women's partners on that show are.

[Berwyn Patsy]

   I read something on the Internet, about Chaz doing DWTS for political reasons?
   All I can tell you is, I am looking forward to seeing who has that dancing talent and rhythm
We all probably wish we were born with.  Being gay, trans gender, straight black or white is not
What I am looking at, or who anyone's partner is honestly for me it's the talent.

[billyjean]

So here you have it.  Chaz and Carson.  The conservative groups feel ABC is pushing a gay/lesbian/agenda.  The retort back is that these are all ppl and have every right to appear on the show.  That Chaz born a woman, changed to a man should be able to dance his heart out.  That Carson, a gay man should be able to do same.  Two ppl who represent their respective groups are out there showing everyone ... see we are just like everyone else.  I get that.

Here's the only thing I see that is disingenuous:

Chaz dancing with a woman ... CORRECT, however,
Carson dancing with a woman ... INCORRECT.

First off, DWTS has already had a gay contestant - Lance Bass.  Why weren't you complaining when Lance was on the show.

  Second, when Bristol Palin was on the show, does that mean DWTS was pushing a conservative agenda?

  Third, why can't a gay man dance with a woman? Why is that incorrect?  They're not having sex - they're just dancing, for gosh sakes.

Ted, I tune in once in awhile.  I'm not an avid fan like Patsy.  However, to answer your question, I'm sure there were plenty of ppl that had a problem with Palin being on the show.  She's not a celebrity of any kind other than that she is the daughter of a woman who ran for VP.  It's TV that wants to make these ppl into celebrities.  I have no interest in her or her mother for that matter.  It's all manufactured BS.

Nobody said a gay man can't dance with a woman.  No one stopped me from dancing with girlfriends as I partied away in my youth.  However, you miss an important point.  It's ballroom dancing.  Not club dancing.  Not dancing at a party in someone's basement.  It's a show that portrays ballroom style dancing.  That style of dancing has a romantic element to it.  If you can't see that ... I can't help you.  To have a gay man PRETEND to be romantic and flirt with a woman is ridiculous.  If they truly want to be REAL ... then dance with a man.  The gender that they are truly and believably attracted to.  I'm just being nit picky I suppose, cause the REAL reason Carson is there is to add comedy, cause that is what he is all about.

I personally don't care if he dances with a chimpanzee.  Gays spend so much time fighting for rights and when they get a chance to actually do something ... they chicken out.  In this case, ABC considered a male partner for Carson, but voted it down.  Instead of gays coming out against ABC for the vote down ... they decided not to fight their liberal friends and spoil a good thing.

Spin it how you want, Ted.  But, I won't buy it.  I am sure tho Carson will be hilarious.

A real hilarity would be Chaz and Carson dancing together.  That way you get the boy/girl and I get the boy/boy.  It's soooooooooooooo complicated, but interesting.

[Mimi]

To have a gay man PRETEND to be romantic and flirt with a woman is ridiculous. 

I don't think it's ridiculous at all -- and I think Louis Van Amstel has done a fabulous job of "pretending" when he's been on the show. In fact, I think most of the contestants/pros have done a great job of pretending to be romantic while they dance. Do you think all those straight contestants have REALLY been attracted to their dance partners on the show? How about the married contestants and pros who pretend to be romantic while their spouses look on? The ones who seem to do the best are the ones who can fake a little chemistry.

Although, sometimes it's the ones who DON'T have chemistry that are the most fun to watch! Buzz Aldrin? Tom Delay?

[Berwyn Patsy]

  It's called acting.

[billyjean]

Look ... they are all acting.  I agree.  You don't have to REALLY be romantically involved to do ballroom dancing.

But go down the list:

Guys paired with gals.
Gals paired with guys.
A gal that changed her sex to a guy ... paired with a gal.
A gay man dancing with a woman.

Which of the above does not fit with the rest.

If the gay community doesn't care that one of it's own has to dance with a chick because ABC doesn't have the balls to let him dance with a male partner ... that's on them. 

The program has made a flat statement that there will be NO same sex dancing.  So that means that even if Nancy Grace, who is straight, wants to dance with another woman ... she can't.

Neither straight nor gay can dance with the same sex ... EXCEPT !!!! for Chaz.  Now follow the bouncing ball and do try to explain all this to the little ones as they sit anxiously awaiting each performance.

LOL ... what a hoot.

[buzz]

In 1976 the USTA refused to allow Dr. Renee Richards a place in the U.S. Open, claiming a "must be born a women" policy.
In 1977 the Supreme Court ruled in favor of Dr. Richards.  At the time, this was considered a landmark decision for transexuals.
Here we are almost 35 years later and small minded people still think this stuff is news, or novel.

I don't watch the show.  I won't tune in for Chaz.  But if you are a viewer, and like Patsy, just want to be entertained, then enjoy.  What's the BFD ?
I don't get the shtick about ballroom dancing at all.  Is he only allowed to tap ?  Bunny Hop ?  Lambada perhaps ?

[billyjean]

In 1976 the USTA refused to allow Dr. Renee Richards a place in the U.S. Open, claiming a "must be born a women" policy.
In 1977 the Supreme Court ruled in favor of Dr. Richards.  At the time, this was considered a landmark decision for transexuals.
Here we are almost 35 years later and small minded people still think this stuff is news, or novel.

I don't watch the show.  I won't tune in for Chaz.  But if you are a viewer, and like Patsy, just want to be entertained, then enjoy.  What's the BFD ?
I don't get the shtick about ballroom dancing at all.  Is he only allowed to tap ?  Bunny Hop ?  Lambada perhaps ?

I have no problem with Chaz at all.  I just questioned why Carson is dancing with a woman.  Looked like an opportunity lost by the gay community thanks to ABC's decision not to allow same sex partners.

buzz, you need to look up ballroom dancing, and there you will find all your answers.

[billyjean]

In 1976 the USTA refused to allow Dr. Renee Richards a place in the U.S. Open, claiming a "must be born a women" policy.
In 1977 the Supreme Court ruled in favor of Dr. Richards.  At the time, this was considered a landmark decision for transexuals.
Here we are almost 35 years later and small minded people still think this stuff is news, or novel.

buzz, I forgot you posted about Dr. Richards.  First, Dr. Richards did not have the sex change until about 40.  Long past a competitive age and condition for tennis.  Nevertheless, you had this 6'2" woman now wanting to compete against females.  Back when Richards was at Yale, he was captain of the tennis team.  So, I would think he had been a decent player at some point, however, he/she was never able to do any better than be ranked 20th in professional women's tennis.  Going to sound like a movie trailer intro here ... but ... IN A WORLD, of professional and even non-professional sports, things have gotten outta hand with performance enhancing drugs to gain the unfair advantage.  Years ago, I believe they were much more strict on this kinda stuff.  Dr. Richards had no real impact, other than to be the first man to woman sex change to play the game of professional women's tennis, in an era I might add where previously women's tennis was not even on the map, but all of a sudden women's tennis became more popular than men's.  I was a big tennis fan during all this and couldn't get enough of it.  It was glorious.  Richards may have been controversial, but tennis was just following what was already being done in Olympics.  However, in Olympics it was men PRETENDING to be women ... disguises, than actual sex change.

Things could have been different with Richards, however, despite what any court decided, if Richards would have had the change in late teens ... now ready to compete in let's say mid-20's against female players.  She would not have had the disadvantage of AGE, or loss of agility and strength as we all know comes with aging.  I don't think Richards was trying to PROVE anything.  I simply think she wanted to become a woman, loved tennis, and wanted to compete.  Her ranking and ability proved that being 6'2", and 40, and once a man was not, in this instance, an unfair advantage.  I do think it might have been different tho if she had been in her prime, and I think then in that instance there would have been an outcry if she had been seen to completely destroy every opponent indicating a mismatch based on previous sex.

Over time, I believe the majority of instances have been men changing into women to compete against women.  You don't see many women changing into men to compete against men.  Geez, I wonder why?  

Be honest, I'm more concerned about Chaz's weight than his sex change.  He should have had his weight as a priority over the change.  Instead of going on DWTS, he should have signed up with, what's the name of that show .... The Biggest Loser.

[billyjean]

I vote Ron Artest off.  I guess there is a difference between basketball moves and dancing moves.  He's a giant !!!!

[Ted]

I vote Ron Artest off.  I guess there is a difference between basketball moves and dancing moves.  He's a giant !!!!

I agree.  He was really stiff and off-rhythm yesterday.

  It's funny how football players do so well on DWTS but basketball players don't.  Maybe it does have something to do with the height.

[billyjean]

^ yes, maybe height does have something to do with it.  His partner just seemed so small next to him.  Petra is 5'7" and he's 6'7".  Maybe if he had a taller partner?

Even tho I am voting against Artest, none of the contestants did that well.  I think David (he will be competative) did very well, Chaz and Carson did the best just on entertainment value, however, I think they will improve on the dancing part. 

(remember, comments are not on the pro partners, but just the contestants).

The female soccer player? omg, the shots of her from behind ...  spreading her legs to make the long sweeping moves .... was horrible.  She should find that video and burn it.  She looked like she was spreading her legs to get on an extremely obese elephant.  Terrible.  He partner was trying to teach her to be graceful ... she's got a long way to go.

And Clooney's X was awful also.  There is nothing sexy about that girl.  It's not natural for her I guess except when she's taking still shots in front of a camera, cause it sure as hell didn't transfer over here ... and she was criticized for that.

Funniest was Nancy Grace asking her partner Tristan (from Ireland) what a Turd Step is?  LOL .... he was saying THIRD, but with his brogue .... lol