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The Obama Economy

Started by jake, April 27, 2012, 08:09:31 PM

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markberwyn

#40
April 30, 2012, 07:07:27 AM
The president is a central planner!
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

markberwyn

#41
April 30, 2012, 07:11:57 AM
What was it about growing up in a madrassa that made the president a megalomaniac, do you think?
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

markberwyn

#42
April 30, 2012, 07:12:35 AM
Maybe he's born with it. Maybe it's dog.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

eno

#43
April 30, 2012, 08:27:08 AM Last Edit: April 30, 2012, 08:28:50 AM by eno
Quote from: Ted on April 30, 2012, 06:53:30 AM
  We are coming out of the worst depression since the 30s.  Despite what you want to believe, Europe does matter and a comparison to Europe does matter, since we live in a global economy and Europe was faced with the same situation 4 years ago.

  Obama was handed 3 huge turd balls when he entered office - the Bush Wars; the Bush Debt and the Bush Depression. 

  Obama had a choice - either go with an austerity program and pay down the debt (at the start of a depression) or spend to stimulate the economy, which would increase the debt.

  Obama chose stimulating the economy. Britain and Germany chose austerity programs.  4 years later, the depression in Europe is getting worse while America is recovering.

  America's GDP increase was over 2% while Europe's decreased.

   That's an indication that Obama made the right moves.  If Obama had followed the advice of Republican and the tea partiers, America would be in a same predicament as Europe.

  People are going to ask themselves what Reagan asked in 1980 - Are we better off now than we were 4 year ago?

The answer is yes.

Ted:

With all due respect, the part about "Bush debt" being a turd-ball, but "Obama debt" (which is substantially higher) being a magic salve makes no sense.

Also, your comparing the U.S. to Europe is misplaced; Europe is farther along the socialist, welfare state curve than we are (though Obama and the Dems have the U.S. closing quickly). Austerity measures aren't a matter of choice for some EU countries, but rather a last ditch effort to avoid a catastrophic default.

Finally, the measures which Tea-party Republicans are proposing (and which have passed the House several times) are geared towards merely containing/slowing the rate of growth in spending, and lowering taxes (which would stimulate investment and growth); these are hardly "austerity programs" (which in Europe, incidentally, included tax hikes). Obama, on the other hand, rejected his own panel's recommendations (Simpson-Bowles), and then presented a budget which didn't garner a single Democrat vote!

By any reasonable standard, Obama's policy (spending and more spending) has failed and has damaged the economy, preventing it from rebounding; growth in the U.S. is a joke, the job-market has been nuked, individual and family incomes are down, the housing market is still in the toilet, and after almost four years of this president, the trend is flat-to-lower with no light at the end of the tunnel. By every objective measure, we are much worse off than four years ago.

eno
"None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers: a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us." - Paul Ryan

markberwyn

#44
April 30, 2012, 08:28:45 AM
The economy is not rebounding.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

markberwyn

#45
April 30, 2012, 08:29:21 AM
GDP growth is not a reasonable standard for measuring the economy.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

markberwyn

#46
April 30, 2012, 08:30:08 AM
The president and Democrats don't agree, but both are bringing us close to a socialist welfare state.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

eno

#47
April 30, 2012, 08:31:32 AM
Quote from: markberwyn on April 30, 2012, 08:28:45 AM
The economy is not rebounding.

It actually has rebounded for Obama's fat-cat Wall Street pals...the "one-percent."
"None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers: a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us." - Paul Ryan

markberwyn

#48
April 30, 2012, 10:30:29 AM
The president wants socialism and befriends Wall Street fat cats.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

eno

#49
April 30, 2012, 10:46:50 AM
Quote from: markberwyn on April 30, 2012, 10:30:29 AM
The president wants socialism and befriends Wall Street fat cats.

Astute observation! History has a way of repeating, doesn't it?

"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini

There is nothing new under the sun.


"None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers: a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us." - Paul Ryan

markberwyn

#50
April 30, 2012, 11:13:13 AM
The president is a fascist/socialist/capitalist.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

Boris

#51
April 30, 2012, 12:20:35 PM
Quote from: markberwyn on April 30, 2012, 11:13:13 AM
The president is a fascist/socialist/capitalist.

...but don't forget that he's also a radical black Christian theologist, and a Muslim born in Kenya.
Only the impossible always happens.
- - R. Buckminster Fuller

markberwyn

#52
April 30, 2012, 12:26:53 PM
The president is a fascist socialist capitalist radical black Christian liberation theologist Nazi Kenyan Muslim.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

markberwyn

#53
April 30, 2012, 12:27:16 PM
Just imagine what he'll be by suppertime!
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

markberwyn

#54
April 30, 2012, 12:28:46 PM
"Daddy, can I be president someday?"

"Of course you can. Anybody can."

"Even fascist socialist capitalist radical black Christian liberation theologist Nazi Kenyan Muslims?"

"Yes, son. Even you."
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

eno

#55
April 30, 2012, 05:49:42 PM Last Edit: April 30, 2012, 05:54:23 PM by eno
Quote from: markberwyn on April 30, 2012, 12:28:46 PM
"Daddy, can I be president someday?"

"Of course you can. Anybody can."

"Even fascist socialist capitalist radical black Christian liberation theologist Nazi Kenyan Muslims?"

"Yes, son. Even you."

I don't think anyone with a brain could accuse Obama of being Kenyan or Muslim; and what's wrong with being a Kenyan or a Muslim? Their are no Bibles, guns, or clinging involved...

Nor could anyone accuse Obama of being a capitalist; and after all, Capitalism is bad. It doesn't work unless smart people like Obama force all of us stupid folks to spread the wealth around!

You know....the wealth created by hard-working guys like Obama.
"None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers: a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us." - Paul Ryan

Ted

#56
May 01, 2012, 06:33:07 AM Last Edit: May 01, 2012, 06:39:02 AM by Ted
Quote from: eno on April 30, 2012, 08:27:08 AM
...  the part about "Bush debt" being a turd-ball, but "Obama debt" (which is substantially higher) being a magic salve makes no sense.

Also, your comparing the U.S. to Europe is misplaced;

  No, it's not misplaced. It is a valid comparison.

  First, I never said increasing the debt was a magic salve.  What I said was that Obama (as well as countries in Europe) were faced with a dilemma in 2008/2009 - either stimulate their economies by increasing spending or try to eliminate their debt.

Europe took one course (austerity programs) and are now facing an even worse economic situation. America took the other course (spending to stimulate the economy) and America is coming out of bad economic times.

As for the debt not being Bush's turd, before Bush took office we had a booming economy with surpluses.  Bush took that and created a huge debt.   It is indeed Bush's turd.

  btw, how did Reagan get us out of the 1981 recession?  He did the same thing as Obama - spend, spend spend and increase the debt.


Quote from: eno on April 30, 2012, 08:27:08 AM
By any reasonable standard, Obama's policy (spending and more spending) has failed....  By every objective measure, we are much worse off than four years ago.

  You're wrong.  By objective measures, we are a hell of a lot better off today than we were 4 years ago.  The unemployment rate is going down; the housing market is getting better.

  Obama was faced with the largest economic crisis this nation has seen since the Great Depression.  I think most people knew it would take time to recover.  But, the economy is heading in the right direction.

  Only the Obama haters and Fox Noise believe things were better off in 2008 than they are today.

eno

#57
May 01, 2012, 07:43:56 AM
Ted:

If you want to stick with looking at Europe, I suggest you go a bit further into looking at what kind of "austerity" has been implemented in some of the different countries. You may wish to take a look at the Baltic states, look at the depth of their recessions (actually true depressions) the nature and seriousness of the austerity programs they implemented, and the impressive rebounds.

You are being lead over a cliff by a monolithic, uninformed media which wants you to believe that "austerity" means merely reducing the rate of growth of government; real "austerity" means an actual reduction in the size of government. Where countries in Europe actually reduced the size of government significantly (as opposed to merely nipping around the edges) GDP growth is impressive.

Trust me; you can't government spend your way to prosperity. Borrowing and/or printing money eventually leads to disaster.
"None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers: a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us." - Paul Ryan

markberwyn

#58
May 01, 2012, 08:26:01 AM
In countries I'm declining to tell you about, austerity works. Trust me.
"This is a fun house, honey, and if you don't like the two-way mirror, go f*&# yourself." ---Berwyn community pillar Ronnie Lottz, on the undisclosed two-way mirror in the women's restroom at Cigars & Stripes

eno

#59
May 01, 2012, 08:30:15 AM
Quote from: markberwyn on May 01, 2012, 08:26:01 AM
In countries I'm declining to tell you about, austerity works. Trust me.

Quote...You may wish to take a look at the Baltic states...

...No atlases inside the Beltway?


"None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers: a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us." - Paul Ryan
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